Amongst the madness of the Comic-Con show floor, I sat down with Justice League, Justice League of America, Aquaman, and Forever Evil writer Geoff Johns to talk about the upcoming event series.
We talk about villain team-ups, what it means for the heroes of the DC Universe, and how that crazy ending to part one of Trinity War relates to Man of Steel. Plus, is there a Shazam book on the horizon?
IGN Comics: Forever Evil is the first story in the New 52 that’s its own mini-series, its own event, instead of something like Throne of Atlantis or Trinity War that’s in the monthly books. What makes this story the one that gets that distinction?
Geoff Johns: Throne of Atlantis was very focused on Aquaman and expanding that world and reintroducing Atlantis and Ocean Master as a bigger threat. Trinity War is really about examining the Justice Leagues and the heroes that make up those teams, the roles of those teams and really exploiting the fracture between those teams. The superheroes in the DC Universe really haven’t come together yet for something this big. So because they’re fractured, if the villainy is united, they’re going to be exploitable. That’s what Trinity War is really about, and Forever Evil is the next stage of that.
IGN: So it sounds like with the fraction at the end of Trinity War, the villains take over, and I assume that’s probably a reason for the heroes to work through their differences. What would you say putting the villains at the forefront like you’re doing inform what our heroes mean to the DCU?
Johns: One of the things I love about Forever Evil is that you look at these characters and the villains are always busy going up against their heroes. Black Manta has his agenda against Aquaman, or half the Gotham villains are in Arkham, half of them are out; they all have different agendas. But what happens when a force tries to bring all of those agendas together?
What happens when you put Black Manta next to Black Adam? Or when you put Lex Luthor next to Captain Cold? Do these people agree on what to do? What happens when Catwoman is there? What side is she going to land on? And what happens to the few heroes that are left? What happens to any of these villains when they’re side by side and the world’s theirs?
I think analyzing and looking at the villains and what they want is really going to shed some light on how different the villains really are. They’re as different as the heroes. Sometimes they’re more different.
IGN: So then are there some villains that aren’t necessarily on board with world domination?
Johns: Yeah, there are villains that are very much not on board. Look, I think with what happens, the [Flash] rogues at first are very “Okay, let’s see how this plays out.” And the way it plays out, very quickly they realize, “This is not for us. This was better when the Justice League was in charge.” So what are they going to do now? And that doesn’t necessarily mean that they mean to put the Justice League back in charge. But it means they need to stop what’s happening.
IGN: So you’ve written the Flash rogues before and you’ve certainly written your fair share of villains over the years, is there anyone new that you haven’t really worked on before that you’re getting to do in this story?
Johns: There’s a ton of characters, Catwoman in particular, getting center stage and it’s great. But I think that the idea of Black Adam and Sinestro in a room together or Black Manta and Captain Cold on a mission together is what’s very exciting to me. We’ve never seen our biggest villains teamed up together like that, and interacting and really getting to know one another. I’ve had the opportunity to work with the rogues and Captain Cold quite a bit – and Black Adam and Sinestro and Black Manta – but never in a scenario where they’re all united. Forever Evil is really about exploring those characters like that.
IGN: Is there anyone in particular you’re super excited to go back to? I assume Sinestro for sure.
Johns: Captain Cold, for sure. And Sinestro. I’ve always loved villains and there are a lot of villains in it that I’ve never written before. There are a lot of surprise characters that are a lot of fun.
IGN: I want to switch over to JLA really quick. I love the new Atom, I think she’s awesome.
Johns: Good! Thanks, I like her a lot.
IGN: I like that the book has so many lesser known characters that are being built up. Can we expect more of those types of characters after Trinity War?
Johns: Yeah, the JLA is going to get rebuilt during this, so you’re going to see a lot of new characters in the Justice League world. In the vacuum of heroes in Forever Evil, some new heroes will rise. Some will be familiar, and you’ll recognize some that maybe you haven’t seen before in the New 52. There’s a hint at one of them in the very opening scene of Forever Evil #1.
IGN: Oh, awesome. And touching on the end of Justice League #22 last week, in the aftermath of Man of Steel, did that make you apprehensive at all about the kind of story you were about to do? Did it change anything you wanted to do?
Johns: Jeff [Lemire] and I had started talking about this story a long time ago. The timing was kind of serendipitous for us, but the greatest place to strike for villainy would be to have people question Superman. The biggest way to get people to question Superman is by getting him to do something that’s completely counter to everything he is. And it’s a completely different scenario than Man of Steel, obviously. We knew there’d be some chatter and talk, and that’s great. Debate is great. I think the following issue in JLA #6, the heroes and their debate about and Superman’s reaction to it really pays it off in a very strong, emotional way.
It’s a big deal. Superman killed another hero. Again, very different circumstances but the whole idea was the first blow has to be the strongest blow. The villains aren’t going to come on there and try to take down Element Woman, you know? [laughs] They’re going to take down the big gun, and that’s Superman.
IGN: Right. Do you think that’ something he can bounce back from? Can he bounce back from anything?
Johns: We’ll see if he can. He can’t bounce back from everything, but also we’ll see what the circumstances were and what this means.
IGN: Cool! So my last question: I totally loved all of the Shazam stuff you and Gary Frank did in Justice League. Any chance of a Shazam book on the horizon?
Johns: Shazam’s going to be in Trinity War and he’ll be joining the cast of Justice League, but I can’t say anything else right now about Shazam. If people want it, they should keep talking about it.
IGN: I want it!
Johns: If you really want Shazam books, please keep telling everyone. Retailers, DC, us – tweet me, tweet Gary – tell us that you want that book. I love the character; I think he’s one of the most untapped heroes in the DC library. Everyone knows who he is, yet there hasn’t been a lot done with him in a long time.
IGN: Well, you guys have really done a great job so I hope to see more.
Johns: Thank you. It’s fun too; the thing that Gary and I are most proud of and happy with is that the tone of Shazam is so vastly different than a lot of the books out there. Justice League #21 was fun; it’s a romp. And you can have magical tigers and kids that get superpowers and talk to trucks! To be able to do something magical like that and get a reaction like we did was really heartwarming. And then Justice League #22 is the exact opposite!
IGN: [laughs]
Johns: But that’s what I like. I like emotional roller coasters. I want to make Justice League the book where you’re going to kind of know where it’s going to go, but you’re not going to really know where it’s going to go. It should be the biggest surprise book there is.
Joey is a Senior Editor at IGN and a comic book creator. Follow Joey on Twitter @JoeyEsposito, or find him on IGN at Joey-IGN. He often wonders whatever happened to Billy's RadBug.
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